The Global Success Sandbox

The Global Success Sandbox

Contributi 1-10 su 18
  • Darren Sharman
    Darren Sharman
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    Elephant in the corner that no-one is talking about.
    Hi,

    I have a question to all the coaches out there.

    In principle I like the idea of coaching but for me there is one major stumbling block which I would like to address. Maybe some of you are familiar with the phrase often used about consultants. “If you are not part of the solution, there is good money to be made in prolonging the problem”. I guess the same could be said about coaching. We pay our money up front, we get coaching, then maybe we pay again.

    From my perspective a better solution would be something like where the coach is dependant on your results to achieve their results (i.e. their fee or some other sucess criteria).

    For example, I recently had a great trial session with Krissy, but when it came down to the crunch of would I continue with her or not, I got stuck on this point. How is her success, and so her dedication to my success, bound together, basically it wasn’t and I didn’t continue. Now for example if Krissy had said, lets work together to make you successful, I will take 3,000 Euro from the first 10,000 Euro profit that you earn from our agreed actions, I would have jumped at it. Then it is clear to me how our success is bound together, we both have something to gain and we both have something to loose.

    Anyway, that’s my 10p (cents for the Rest of the world) worth, I would like to know other peoples thoughts.

    Regards,

    Darren
    • 18/07/2007, 16:56
  • Krissy Jackson
    Krissy Jackson    Utente Premium   Moderatore gruppo
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    Re: Elephant in the corner that no-one is talking about.
    Before answering this question, I want to say that I have the utmost respect for Darren. He very thoughtfully emailed me this question before posting it to ensure I would not be offended.

    And he did stop me in my tracks for about three minutes,

    …but Darren I have your answer.

    The role of a coach is to be completely impartial and believe in you implicitly, to champion you and to help you achieve your goals.

    If the coach were to have a stake in the success of your business then they would no longer be impartial, they would probably also not really have your interests at heart, but rather their own.

    If making money is your only objective this might be fine, but coaching is usually more about addressing success in all areas of your life, even if a coach says they are a business coach, I think they would take into account how overworking would affect your overall state etc...

    Coaches also do not make promises about outcomes, you will get out as much as you put in - many people in the scenario you suggest, would begin to lean on the coach, instead of actively on finding solutions and acting on them. It might also change the coach client relationship making the accountablility factor fizzle, something that clients often enjoy more than any other aspect of coaching.

    Yes, that was my long-winded way of saying that a coach cannot be impartial if they find themselves personally involved, therefore not to be recommended.

    Warmly,

    Krissy
    Questo contributo è stato modificato in data 18/07/2007 alle ore 17:29.
    • 18/07/2007, 17:25
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  • Krissy Jackson
    Krissy Jackson    Utente Premium   Moderatore gruppo
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    Re^3: Elephant in the corner that no-one is talking about.
    Because your friends are the least impartial people you know after your parents.

    They also have a nasty habit of talking to your other friends. :-)

    If you want someone who is really in your corner a coach is your best bet.

    Having said that, make sure you shop around and find the one who is the best fit for you - this is a very personal relationship.

    Warmly,

    Krissy
    • 18/07/2007, 18:17
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  • Julia Stewart
    Julia Stewart
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    Re^5: Elephant in the corner that no-one is talking about.
    Great question Darren! And great responses from Krissy and Sunny.

    It makes perfect sense that a coach's fee would be connected to the success of the client AND as Krissy mentioned, that would be a disaster, because the coach would no longer be working for the client, they'd be working for the fee.

    Not everybody needs a coach and nobody needs a coach all the time. Somehow, when the right coach and right client connect at the right time, a nuclear reaction takes place and questions like these become non-issues.
    • 19/07/2007, 00:34
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    James Gay
    (non è utente XING)
    Re: Elephant in the corner that no-one is talking about.
    I'm nearly speechless... Amazed, even stunned... To finally hear someone admit that consultants make their money off consulting and not necessarily solving problems.... After having numerous bad experiences with numerous consultants, this is an amazing day. I may sound condescending, but I'm ABSOLUTELY serious.


    If the coach were to have a stake in the success of your business then they would no longer be impartial, they would probably also not really have your interests at heart, but rather their own.
    Darren is asking a classic business perspective question. Since a coach accepts payment for their services, then the coach is already profiting from the relationship. So how can I tell if a coach is motivated by my success or by the continuation of their profit? Darren is suggesting a predefined metric with rewards for achieving significant benchmarks. Doing this ensures that two business entities are pursuing in the same goal; namely, the client's success. Since coaching is largely a subjective experience, I'm not sure how clear measurements and benchmarks would be defined.

    Reversing that question uncovers a significant danger for the coaching industry. Many people, myself included, have a low opinion of consultants for the very reason I've described above. The coaching industry could very easily fall into the same trap.

    Regards,
    James
    • 19/07/2007, 01:50
  • Krissy Jackson
    Krissy Jackson    Utente Premium   Moderatore gruppo
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    Re^2: Elephant in the corner that no-one is talking about.
    Hmmm, James I might be wrong but I think you may have missed the point.

    When we are attached to the outcome of something we have very strong ideas about how we think they should be done, which is important as Sunny explained in the case of consulting.

    Coaches however are taught to listen to what the client wants, what they dream about, what they think is possible. The point is not to curb or negate the client’s creativity, but to trust that they have what it takes to achieve anything they set out to do simply by deciding what they want, setting structure and goals around those plans and then executing the steps to make them happen. The coach’s job is to help the client to define and achieve these goals.

    A coach helps you to clarify what you want from your life and how you want to achieve this.

    So in effect the client is making all the decisions, how they want to proceed, when they want to finish etc... It is usually the rule in coaching to empower the client to move on as soon as they have achieved the results they signed up for in the beginning - this is also in the hands of the client, if they work hard they will achieve this much sooner.

    I know though that there are good and bad in every field. This is something the client will have to monitor.
    Note: A good coach will check in with you regularly, to make sure everything is working for you, and will also encourage you to move on as soon as you are achieving the results you desire.

    A consultant although great in many situations would not have been much use to Thomas Edison, the Curries, or Einstein (Yes, I know these are extreme examples :-) - Coaching is not consulting, coaching enables people to be the biggest and best version of themselves, it is certainly not about following paths just because others have trod them that way and succeeded before.

    Having said this, I am not sure of all the roles a consultant plays. A coach assists in many areas. They will help clients improve their interpersonal relationships, become more confident, set healthy boundaries, and overcome patterns of behavior that are not constructive to name but a few, I am not really clear about the different roles a consultant might take.

    Sunny ...or any of our other consultants could you clarify for us please?
    Questo contributo è stato modificato in data 19/07/2007 alle ore 02:54.
    • 19/07/2007, 02:35
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  • Krissy Jackson
    Krissy Jackson    Utente Premium   Moderatore gruppo
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    Re^4: Elephant in the corner that no-one is talking about.
    Sunny,

    Thank you so much for taking the time to answer my question so comprehensively, I can safely say I have learned something today.

    You are much appreciated.

    Warmly,

    Krissy
    • 19/07/2007, 11:22