Indo-German Software Competence Network (Indescon)

Posts 1-10 of 14

Back
Next

Ashant Chalasani Premium Member Group moderator
The company name is only visible to registered members.

Python Frameworks
Hello All,

We've done a lot of PHP work in our company, mainly e-Commerce and in the past months framework development in ZEND and CakePHP.

Planning our technology roadmap for the next 5 years, we believe Python will be an area to specialize on, since it's every bit a great modern high-level language, has backing from majors like Google (App Engine support) and some high-profile sites (like Youtube).

One of the things that makes serious app development and maintenance possible is to work with frameworks. To that end, I wanted to get your opinions on which you favor.

We've looked into the following:

- Zope (oldtimer, front-runner, but is it still fit enough for modern apps?)
- Pylons
- Django (lot of buzz around this, but I'm asking myself if one can do seriously functional apps, over and beyond newspaper/content-sites which were the genesis of Django)
- WebPy
- Grok (Zope based)

(any important once missing in above list?)

What are your views on Python frameworks?

Thanks & regards
Ashant
- 23 Sep 2010, 09:40 am
Ashant Chalasani wrote: > Hello All, > > We've done a lot of PHP work in our company, mainly e-Commerce and in > the past months framework development in ZEND and CakePHP. > > Planning our technology roadmap for the next 5 years, we believe > Python will be an area to specialize on, since it's every bit a great > modern high-level language, has backing from majors like Google (App > Engine support) and some high-profile sites (like Youtube). > > One of the things that makes serious app development and maintenance > possible is to work with frameworks. To that end, I wanted to get > your opinions on which you favor. > > We've looked into the following: > > - Zope (oldtimer, front-runner, but is it still fit enough for modern > apps?) > - Pylons > - Django (lot of buzz around this, but I'm asking myself if one can > do seriously functional apps, over and beyond newspaper/content-sites > which were the genesis of Django) > - WebPy > - Grok (Zope based) > > (any important once missing in above list?) > > What are your views on Python frameworks? > > Thanks & regards > Ashant
Jan Dittberner
The company name is only visible to registered members.

Re: Python Frameworks
I favour Pylons because it allows the greatest flexibility. It has some recommendations for authentication/authorization, persistence and template engines but it does not force you to use these and allows you to easily replace parts of your application.

You might also want to have a look at TurboGears 2.0 http://turbogears.org/2.0/

Regards
Jan
This post was modified on 23 Sep 2010 at 11:11 am.
- 23 Sep 2010, 11:08 am
Jan Dittberner wrote: > I favour Pylons because it allows the greatest flexibility. It has > some recommendations for authentication/authorization, persistence > and template engines but it does not force you to use these and > allows you to easily replace parts of your application. > > You might also want to have a look at TurboGears 2.0 > http://turbogears.org/2.0/ > > > Regards > Jan
Post visible to registered members
Ashant Chalasani Premium Member Group moderator
The company name is only visible to registered members.

Re^2: Python Frameworks
Thank you for the feedback Jan. I have read some nice things about Turbogears and look forward to evaluating it.

@Yassine - how has your experience with Django been for developing funtionality-rich apps? I'm convinced that it can do CRUD well, but what about business logic? Does Django allow to write rich business logic, and maintain it well?

Thanks
Ashant
- 23 Sep 2010, 3:11 pm
Ashant Chalasani wrote: > Thank you for the feedback Jan. I have read some nice things about > Turbogears and look forward to evaluating it. > > @Yassine - how has your experience with Django been for developing > funtionality-rich apps? I'm convinced that it can do CRUD well, but > what about business logic? Does Django allow to write rich business > logic, and maintain it well? > > Thanks > Ashant
Post visible to registered members
Lynton Grice Premium Member
The company name is only visible to registered members.

Re^2: Python Frameworks
Hi there,

I must say I am not expert on Python Web frameworks but I'll give my 2 cents anyway from the experience I have had:

- Django is super and from my experience with it is very easy to get going with.
- I often look to what the BIG Python applicatons use and as far as I know Zenoss (http://www.zenoss.com) uses Zope and I have heard some really good things about it as well...

I cannot comment on Grok or Turbogears really, but if I ran a company wanting to get into Python I would probably look at Django and Zope first.....

On Zope I see there is a lot of debate over Zope 2 or Zope 3....I would go with Zope 3 personally if I were to go with "Zope"

One person I rate very highly is Duncan McGreggor and although this blog was written in 2006, I still think it is a worthwhile read...

http://oubiwann.blogspot.com/2005/08/django-vs-zope3-or-righ...

Chat later

Lynton
- 23 Sep 2010, 3:38 pm
Lynton Grice wrote: > Hi there, > > I must say I am not expert on Python Web frameworks but I'll give my > 2 cents anyway from the experience I have had: > > - Django is super and from my experience with it is very easy to get > going with. > - I often look to what the BIG Python applicatons use and as far as I > know Zenoss (http://www.zenoss.com) uses Zope and I have heard some > really good things about it as well... > > I cannot comment on Grok or Turbogears really, but if I ran a company > wanting to get into Python I would probably look at Django and Zope > first..... > > On Zope I see there is a lot of debate over Zope 2 or Zope 3....I > would go with Zope 3 personally if I were to go with "Zope" > > One person I rate very highly is Duncan McGreggor and although this > blog was written in 2006, I still think it is a worthwhile read... > > http://oubiwann.blogspot.com/2005/08/django-vs-zope3-or-right-web-app-dev.html > > Chat later > > Lynton
Ashant Chalasani Premium Member Group moderator
The company name is only visible to registered members.

Re^3: Python Frameworks
Comprehensive list of Python Webframeworks: http://vermeulen.ca/python-web-platforms.html

Stackoverflow has a bunch of really good conversations on people who have used, like and dislike Django:

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1344824/django-vs-pylons
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/886221/does-django-scale

A catalog of Django powered sites can be found at http://www.djangosites.org/

For the hardcore performance-freeks who are keen on scaling your web-apps, this is worth a look http://immike.net/files/scaling_django.pdf

But my quest is not for or against Django, it is to find a web-framework that allows building maximum features into a Python web-app with minimum effort.

Django still seems to me to be a framework for content-intensive sites.

The readings suggested by others above are motivating to pursue Zope3 deeper. Some pointers to noobie tutorials on Z3 anyone?

Thanks
Ashant

http://www.euroblaze.de/OXID
This post was modified on 24 Sep 2010 at 02:22 am.
- 23 Sep 2010, 11:06 pm
Ashant Chalasani wrote: > Comprehensive list of Python Webframeworks: > http://vermeulen.ca/python-web-platforms.html > > Stackoverflow has a bunch of really good conversations on people who > have used, like and dislike Django: > > http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1344824/django-vs-pylons > http://stackoverflow.com/questions/886221/does-django-scale > > A catalog of Django powered sites can be found at > http://www.djangosites.org/ > > For the hardcore performance-freeks who are keen on scaling your > web-apps, this is worth a look > http://immike.net/files/scaling_django.pdf > > But my quest is not for or against Django, it is to find a > web-framework that allows building maximum features into a Python > web-app with minimum effort. > > Django still seems to me to be a framework for content-intensive > sites. > > The readings suggested by others above are motivating to pursue Zope3 > deeper. Some pointers to noobie tutorials on Z3 anyone? > > Thanks > Ashant > > http://www.euroblaze.de/OXID
Thomas Robertz
The company name is only visible to registered members.

Re^4: Python Frameworks
I do like working with django a lot, it's very well thought through and you can be pretty productive once you get the hang of it.

They have an active community, I like that there are a lot of really cool and useful things being integrated.

Regarding functionality, I havn't run into any limitations as of yet, I guess it depends on your specs!
I'd just like to mention that like in pylons or turbogears, in django, too, you can switch out components easily, for instance I am using jinja2 as template renderer (with the coffin wrapper for django).

I havn't tried it, but if not django I would probably next try turbogears.
- 24 Sep 2010, 11:25 pm
Thomas Robertz wrote: > I do like working with django a lot, it's very well thought through > and you can be pretty productive once you get the hang of it. > > They have an active community, I like that there are a lot of really > cool and useful things being integrated. > > Regarding functionality, I havn't run into any limitations as of yet, > I guess it depends on your specs! > I'd just like to mention that like in pylons or turbogears, in > django, too, you can switch out components easily, for instance I am > using jinja2 as template renderer (with the coffin wrapper for > django). > > I havn't tried it, but if not django I would probably next try > turbogears.
Post visible to registered members
Ashant Chalasani Premium Member Group moderator
The company name is only visible to registered members.

Re^2: Python Frameworks / Google App-Engine
Hi Alexander,

Thanks for the note on Zope. Would your comments hold for Zope3 as well?

I think Google's support for Django on Google App Engine speaks for the long-term sustainability of this framework.

http://code.google.com/p/google-app-engine-django/

Here's a quick video-tutorial on creating a guest-book app on the Google App-Engine - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfgO-LXGpTM

Then again, at is core Google's businesses are driven on content, which might explain this tending toward Django?

Regards
Ashant (http://www.euroblaze.de/OXID)
This post was modified on 25 Sep 2010 at 05:51 pm.
- 25 Sep 2010, 10:47 am
Ashant Chalasani wrote: > Hi Alexander, > > Thanks for the note on Zope. Would your comments hold for Zope3 as > well? > > I think Google's support for Django on Google App Engine speaks for > the long-term sustainability of this framework. > > http://code.google.com/p/google-app-engine-django/ > > Here's a quick video-tutorial on creating a guest-book app on the > Google App-Engine - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfgO-LXGpTM > > Then again, at is core Google's businesses are driven on content, > which might explain this tending toward Django? > > Regards > Ashant (http://www.euroblaze.de/OXID)